This site requires the Adobe Flash Player.
straightegyptians

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

> Blue List And Blue Star, The difference?
Razzmatazz
post Dec 16 2007, 10:46 PM
Post #1


Advanced Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 50
Joined: 14-November 07
From: Iowa
Member No.: 9545



Could someone please explain what the difference is between Blue Star and Blue List? Are they a specific family or strain...? Can a horse be both, or only one or the other?

Thank you for your input,
Teresa
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
 
Start new topic
Replies
diane
post Dec 19 2007, 02:32 AM
Post #2


Gold Member
Group Icon

Group: Members
Posts: 2218
Joined: 18-March 03
From: Vale View, Toowoomba, Australia
Member No.: 117



QUOTE (JacqueB @ Dec 19 2007, 01:21 AM)
What is Mu'niqiyah, Mu'iqui blood?  I think I understand it to be a strain.  If it is a strain, then what are the characteristics of that strain? Be sure and answer this question & be specific - no euphemisms.

Is Diane's point that any desert/asil horse may have Mu'iqui blood and therefore Turkomen blood if you go back far enough? Including the Abbas Pasha horses which is largely the basis for the PS definition of SE? and, of course, Blue Star horses?

Thanks Jacque
*

Jacque - not ignoring you... I'll reply shortly wink.gif

Edited...

Firstly - Muni'gi is a name. Strain naming is a naming protocol generated through necessity by the nomadic Bedouin's culture. They were nomadic, this infers that they did not travel with unnecessary belongings including any written materials such as pedigrees. Instead, they generated a naming system / protocol by which they could identify and keep track of their asil breeding stock. There were other horses in the region, the asil population only being a portion of them. There needed to be a mechanism - a protocol other than a written form. It is suggested that the Bedouin was faithful to the naming of the strains and forthright if the mare(s) was won from them so that the tradition could be maintained.

Second - Its a strain name which was popularised (as like any other strain name) by what could be seen of a few representatives at that time in history by a few westerners. The genetic history of the asil horse itself was not known, or by comparison, extremely limited therefore what its genetic background held in store for future generations would be found out only by the practice of breeding and somewhat western understanding. The immediate families from the desert and/or Egypt bred differently. If strains were a genetic power and were so incredibly resilient, these differences would not have happened. There wouldn't have been family differences from the first asil imports.

To your second question ~ essentially, yes (per the discussion on the Turkoman / Akhal Teke thread). Quite simply we do not know the full history of the asil horse as bred by the nomadic Bedouin. The fact is that it was the nomadic Bedouin who more or less created what they define as the asil desert bred horse. Whether or not this asil desert bred horse is genetically pure or not remains inconsequential. Their generations of culture and persistence has given us the modern asil desert horse. Simply look at the differences that can be seen today from the asil ancestors barely one hundred years ago. By breeding in what can amount to line breeding (closed, finite gene pool) the refinement of the Breed continues.

Quite simply, as Joe has said, we are following and promoting the results of a very specific culture. MHO there is no genetic purity. This has been proven of human kind. Horses, any horses (or that matter any creature), are shaped and bred by cultural definitions and climatic limitations.
smile.gif

This post has been edited by diane: Dec 19 2007, 11:09 PM
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Posts in this topic
- Razzmatazz   Blue List And Blue Star   Dec 16 2007, 10:46 PM
- - reidfm   The Blue Arabian Horse Catalog -- Jane Llewellyn O...   Dec 16 2007, 11:43 PM
- - diane   QUOTE (reidfm @ Dec 17 2007, 09:43 AM)The Blu...   Dec 17 2007, 01:35 AM
- - Razzmatazz   Can you please explain the issue with Muniqi? Why ...   Dec 17 2007, 01:36 PM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 17 2007, 02:35 AM)Its unde...   Dec 17 2007, 02:30 PM
- - diane   QUOTE (Echo1 @ Dec 18 2007, 12:30 AM)untrue ...   Dec 17 2007, 10:27 PM
- - diane   QUOTE (Razzmatazz @ Dec 17 2007, 11:36 PM)Can...   Dec 17 2007, 10:29 PM
- - Bandit   If a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it,...   Dec 17 2007, 10:55 PM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 17 2007, 11:29 PM)The gene...   Dec 18 2007, 12:36 AM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (reidfm @ Dec 17 2007, 12:43 AM)The Blu...   Dec 18 2007, 12:38 AM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 17 2007, 11:55 PM)If a tr...   Dec 18 2007, 12:39 AM
- - diane   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 18 2007, 08:55 AM)If a tr...   Dec 18 2007, 02:53 AM
- - Bandit   QUOTE (Echo1 @ Dec 17 2007, 06:39 PM)A tree l...   Dec 18 2007, 03:13 AM
- - JoeFerriss   I am just saying this off the top of my head witho...   Dec 18 2007, 04:10 AM
- - diane   QUOTE (Echo1 @ Dec 18 2007, 10:39 AM)A tree l...   Dec 18 2007, 04:42 AM
- - Nadj al Nur   Diane.......just to play the devil's advocate,...   Dec 18 2007, 06:53 AM
- - diane   QUOTE (Nadj al Nur @ Dec 18 2007, 04:53 PM)Di...   Dec 18 2007, 07:03 AM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 18 2007, 04:13 AM)Well su...   Dec 18 2007, 01:34 PM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 18 2007, 05:42 AM)... the ...   Dec 18 2007, 01:44 PM
- - Bandit   QUOTE (Echo1 @ Dec 18 2007, 07:34 AM)When con...   Dec 18 2007, 02:04 PM
- - Echo1   Joe Ferriss, Thank you for your post. It solidifi...   Dec 18 2007, 02:34 PM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 18 2007, 03:04 PM)Well yo...   Dec 18 2007, 02:41 PM
- - JacqueB   I need a history lesson here. What is Mu'niqiy...   Dec 18 2007, 03:21 PM
- - Bandit   I doubt going to the middle east would get you any...   Dec 18 2007, 10:54 PM
- - JacqueB   Hi Bandit, Let me add that I'm new to SE/deser...   Dec 18 2007, 11:54 PM
- - Bandit   QUOTE (JacqueB @ Dec 18 2007, 05:54 PM)So Ban...   Dec 19 2007, 12:19 AM
- - Marilee   We are all learning. I love Mr. Ferriss's way...   Dec 19 2007, 12:30 AM
- - diane   QUOTE (Echo1 @ Dec 18 2007, 11:44 PM)You...   Dec 19 2007, 02:21 AM
- - Bandit   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 18 2007, 08:21 PM)To follo...   Dec 19 2007, 03:08 AM
- - BasiliskBelka   IMO, the whole Blue Star thing is of questionable ...   Dec 19 2007, 02:07 PM
- - BasiliskBelka   With regard to the Caspian Horse (*not* pony - it ...   Dec 19 2007, 02:10 PM
- - JoeFerriss   I tend to think that the preservation of the deser...   Dec 19 2007, 03:01 PM
- - diane   quote:Joe Ferriss Dec 20 2007, 01:01 AM I tend to ...   Dec 19 2007, 10:36 PM
- - JacqueB   Thanks Joe for your post. And thanks Diane for hig...   Dec 19 2007, 11:18 PM
- - Kimberli Nelson   If nothing else is said, it must be noted that the...   Dec 19 2007, 11:21 PM
- - Marilee   Dear jb: You should get a gold star for asking al...   Dec 19 2007, 11:22 PM
- - diane   QUOTE (Kimberli Nelson @ Dec 20 2007, 09:21 A...   Dec 20 2007, 12:09 AM
- - diane   JacqueB, Dec 20 2007, 09:18 AM writes: And thanks ...   Dec 20 2007, 12:33 AM
- - JacqueB   Well Diane, I discovered you edit - thanks. Part o...   Dec 20 2007, 12:53 AM
- - JacqueB   Thanks Diane, So the Mu'niqi is associated wit...   Dec 20 2007, 01:18 AM
- - Kimberli Nelson   Thank you Diane, Having been involved with the Ar...   Dec 20 2007, 01:29 AM
- - Seglavi   Kim, You said an eloquent mouthful! Go girl...   Dec 20 2007, 04:08 AM
- - diane   my pleasure. Its slippery thwang to catch. It he...   Dec 20 2007, 04:33 AM
- - BeckyHuffman   QUOTE (Razzmatazz @ Dec 16 2007, 11:46 PM)Cou...   Dec 20 2007, 04:54 AM
- - BeckyHuffman   >>Personally, I feel the entire 'Blue...   Dec 20 2007, 05:01 AM
- - anitae   Hello to all who have the courage to enter into th...   Dec 20 2007, 06:40 AM
- - diane   QUOTE (anitae @ Dec 20 2007, 04:40 PM)For me,...   Dec 20 2007, 07:00 AM
- - JacqueB   Good Morning Diane, It's extremely valuable to...   Dec 20 2007, 01:29 PM
- - JoeFerriss   JacqueB, I want to thank you for your original que...   Dec 20 2007, 02:38 PM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (JacqueB @ Dec 18 2007, 04:21 PM)I need...   Dec 20 2007, 03:00 PM
- - JacqueB   Ahh Joe, Went to the AHA arabdatasource and they...   Dec 20 2007, 03:25 PM
- - Bandit   Arey you having fun yet JacqueB? . Im having a b...   Dec 20 2007, 03:55 PM
- - JacqueB   You know, I've been thinking, "why don...   Dec 20 2007, 03:59 PM
- - Nadj al Nur   Actually, some of Raswan's books are very avai...   Dec 20 2007, 04:21 PM
- - Bandit   I guess I should of said "some" of Raswa...   Dec 20 2007, 04:32 PM
- - JoeFerriss   QUOTE (JacqueB @ Dec 20 2007, 04:25 PM)Ahh Jo...   Dec 20 2007, 05:53 PM
- - BasiliskBelka   What I meant by the Blue Catalogue being 'past...   Dec 20 2007, 06:26 PM
- - Jenny Lees   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 18 2007, 11:54 PM)I doubt...   Dec 20 2007, 06:35 PM
- - Jenny Lees   QUOTE (anitae @ Dec 20 2007, 07:40 AM)For me,...   Dec 20 2007, 06:50 PM
- - 2mntn   Hello JoeFerriss, Yes, it is too bad that *Ibn Ha...   Dec 20 2007, 07:01 PM
- - Tous crins   QUOTE (2mntn @ Dec 20 2007, 11:01 AM)Hello Jo...   Dec 20 2007, 07:03 PM
- - 2mntn   Hi Jenny, I am hearing of US horses being exporte...   Dec 20 2007, 07:04 PM
- - Jenny Lees   QUOTE (2mntn @ Dec 20 2007, 08:04 PM)Hi Jenny...   Dec 20 2007, 07:46 PM
- - Bandit   Im gonna get it right in a minute. Finally: http...   Dec 20 2007, 07:55 PM
- - curtislt   Ray, I have an Almileegy++ granddaughter and have...   Dec 20 2007, 07:58 PM
- - JacqueB   Cathy, I think we'll have to give a nod to Dia...   Dec 20 2007, 08:12 PM
- - 2mntn   Curt - thanks so much for the photo of Almileegy++...   Dec 20 2007, 08:31 PM
- - Nadj al Nur   I think that it is the Hamdan influence that I lik...   Dec 20 2007, 08:46 PM
- - Jenny Lees   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 20 2007, 08:55 PM)Im gonn...   Dec 20 2007, 10:31 PM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 19 2007, 03:21 AM)To follo...   Dec 21 2007, 12:35 AM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 20 2007, 01:33 AM)It must,...   Dec 21 2007, 01:29 AM
- - JacqueB   Wait a minute, Wait a minute, Echo1, I've been...   Dec 21 2007, 01:57 AM
- - 2mntn   Hello Echo1, Sorry, I didn't mean to take thi...   Dec 21 2007, 02:23 AM
- - BeckyHuffman   Wow! This forum has been busy today. re: th...   Dec 21 2007, 02:25 AM
- - BeckyHuffman   I'm afraid I'm confused by the discussion ...   Dec 21 2007, 02:31 AM
- - BeckyHuffman   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 20 2007, 08:00 AM)From her...   Dec 21 2007, 02:42 AM
- - diane   QUOTE (diane @ Dec 20 2007, 10:33 AM)From the...   Dec 21 2007, 03:05 AM
- - diane   QUOTE (BeckyHuffman @ Dec 21 2007, 12:25 PM)D...   Dec 21 2007, 03:08 AM
- - diane   Joe - thank you for the candid images of Ibn Hafiz...   Dec 21 2007, 04:41 AM
- - Tous crins   There are quite a few pictures of Muniquis taken b...   Dec 21 2007, 05:42 AM
- - JacqueB   thanks Tous Crins, for that link, also had a list ...   Dec 21 2007, 01:05 PM
- - BasiliskBelka   Um - before anyone not familiar with Raswan aka Ca...   Dec 21 2007, 01:42 PM
- - BeckyHuffman   Wouldn't it be nice if the world was cleanly d...   Dec 21 2007, 02:27 PM
- - Tous crins   QUOTE (JacqueB @ Dec 21 2007, 05:05 AM)thanks...   Dec 21 2007, 04:42 PM
- - JacqueB   No Christine, didn't make it to the west coast...   Dec 21 2007, 05:24 PM
- - Tous crins   QUOTE (JacqueB @ Dec 21 2007, 09:24 AM)No Chr...   Dec 21 2007, 05:34 PM
- - JacqueB   Christine, Do you speak Dutch? jb   Dec 21 2007, 05:58 PM
- - Tous crins   QUOTE (JacqueB @ Dec 21 2007, 09:58 AM)Christ...   Dec 21 2007, 06:31 PM
- - diane   Becky writes: Wouldn't it be nice if the world...   Dec 22 2007, 09:35 AM
- - JacqueB   Good Morning Christine, My husband was working in ...   Dec 22 2007, 11:42 AM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (BeckyHuffman @ Dec 21 2007, 03:31 AM)I...   Dec 22 2007, 02:47 PM
- - JacqueB   Thanks Echo1, for your explanation. I was thinkin...   Dec 22 2007, 04:01 PM
- - Bandit   QUOTE (Echo1 @ Dec 22 2007, 08:47 AM)Hi Becky...   Dec 22 2007, 04:37 PM
- - Jenny Lees   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 20 2007, 08:55 PM)Im gonn...   Dec 22 2007, 05:12 PM
- - Echo1   QUOTE (Bandit @ Dec 22 2007, 05:37 PM)I see b...   Dec 22 2007, 11:08 PM
- - Bandit   Of course I agree with you Echo. I hope it could ...   Dec 23 2007, 12:59 AM
- - BeckyHuffman   Echo1 said: However, what is interesting, is that ...   Dec 23 2007, 01:16 AM
- - BeckyHuffman   QUOTE (Echo1 @ Dec 23 2007, 12:08 AM)Hi Bandi...   Dec 23 2007, 01:28 AM
- - diane   I can relate to the gist of the conversations so f...   Dec 23 2007, 01:30 AM
3 Pages V   1 2 3 >


Reply to this topicStart new topic

 

Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 1st November 2014 - 05:17
This site requires the Adobe Flash Player.