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HLM
Dear Marilee

what you are saying is not fair if you meant it as another person understood it to be, namely detrimental. By knowing the past we can change the presence and with it the future. People who are unwilling to sign their name for their opinions can not possibly mean well when their posts are attacking others.
I fully realize that those where the shoe fits will will be upset being caught.


Many of us including myself have tried for years to focus on corrections so that ALL SE breeders/owners benefit, in particular our small ones. Even today a lot of bad things are going on and some can be avoided.

People are not driven away if they can use the Se they intend to buy and deal with a reputable organization/person. Reminding of the past how all was done and accomplished is a guideline which can be followed. Such guideline still is "having the SEs under Saddle" at least the stallions. I dont believe that such demand is out of line. NO-one CAN IMPROVE ON ANY BREED, IF IT IS NOT TESTED! And I really dont know of any which refuses such. People buy horses so that they can ride or drive them and their value is then determined as to what they are as athletes. It then remains to be seen what they can produce and genetically carry forward.

allhave a nice day
Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
HLM
Dear Manuela

First of all, thank you Oliver for showing the photo.

Now where are these two stallions "Nose on Nose"???
they are standing far enough apart, just as it would be on other occasions.
they do not "smell each other" nose on nose as you can see. I can not remember Tom McNair ever putting a stud nose on nose, matter of fact he taught me a lot, safety first!

I have heard and even once seen that a stallion grabbed its owner by the chest.Reason, the handler had just hugged another stallion and its scent was still noticable by the attacking stallion.

But here is what I mean, "If they do it why cant others" you said Manuel.
And that can be dangerous.

Have a nice day
Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
Guest
Yes Hansi we know your saying about the shoe fitting, only you seem to think that it fits everyone who doesn't take your shoe size. You think, and always will think, that your opinion is the only correct one, and that you have the right to attack people because they see things differently. That is what annoys people, and stops them reading your posts. They rather take advice from people who also have a lot of experience and knowlegde, but share it in a less aggressive and assertive way. Often you just shout out your opinion again and again like you're wearing blinkers, but you don't want to actually discuss things objectively, trying to understand those who have a different opinion (which would be better than just ignoring them or implying that they are simply stupid). Now that's a pity, because that would be much more educational. Talking WITH instead of talking AT people.

I'm not saying this to hurt you, but I just hope you might one day try to see how your words come across, and that you could share your experience in a more effective way if you treated your fellow forum members in a normal way, not as silly little first-graders who don't know one end of a horse from the other.
HLM
To all those "Guests"

there is a destinct difference between your and my posts, I dont attack people personally and by name. Second, I sign my posts. this difference alone
makes all the difference I think.

Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
Guest
O.K. forget it, I should have known better than to believe you might be interested in anyone's opinion except your own. Oh well, I suppose everyone has to get a kick out of life in some way - if this is yours, then I'm a little sad for you, but I wish you the best of it.
HLM
You lost me guest, dont even know what you are realy driving at. You obviously read my post, as many others do.

First of all I do get a kick out of putting people back into the saddle, having the beautiful SEs shown in performance, especially stress performances where many would excell.

What I regret that I never met you, therefore could not ask if I may come and see your horses, because also I had russian bloodlines in our Non-SE Stock, and that from early 80ties on. I enjoy visiting Arabian Breeding farms, regardles of what bloodlines they prefer.Just wished I be a bit younger and could do more. By visiting farms with other bloodlines it keeps me up to date of what competition is out there. Do you visit SE farms?

And finally, had I met you at the Salon de Cheval I would have remembered. I still have an excellent memory.
so let the matter rest, let us think of what we can do to bring the SEs back on track and help outroot corruption and deceit.

Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
Zahra Bint Krayaan
I'm a new comer, and if i listened to my parents i would only have one horse!

Although they speak sense in alot of matters, role models in horses they are not.

They are completely unhorsey.


I am largely self taught. And by watching people, and had i gone to my first arab show when i was alot younger, in all fairness, i would of copied what i saw!

Why, because they are more experienced than me, and i would think they would know what they are doing.
Thank god i didn't.

I went to my first arab show at the age of 24! And was shocked, disappointed, and in some cases i've never seen such stupid behaivour.

Shaking one of those shaker things at a stallion who entered the ring, and he nearly did the splits, we all know what could of happened had he done so.

I completely agree with what Hansi and Keren.

I know neither of them, but thankgod they are here.

I know Keren posts on arabian lines, thanks Keren for coming back, i really missed your posts.
Hansi i have no idea about, although she can be a bit blunt at times, i think that is what is needed.
You all say it's only Hansi's opinion, and everyone has to think like her, but you lot are exactly the same, you think theres nothing wrong in the way arabs are shown. Time will tell.

The only suggestion i can come up with, is let the show world carry destroying our breed, but also lets all get out there, and show how wonderful, and verstalie, and sensible our breed actually is. Let us see the variety in different training, and showing methods.
Nikki gbfahne.gif
lionsdenfarm
OK, there are some things done at shows that should not be done at all or by someone who does not know what they are doing.

One thing to remember is that most people don't own a stallion and even less own more than one stallion. So making this such a point is kind of just wasting time isn't it? And I do think that most people do have enough common sense to not do stupid stuff with their horses.

We all make mistakes, we all get hurt. It is just part of the learning process and we try again or give up. Just like in school with Math class--you either learn it and get on or you give up and take something else.

And for what it is worth, there was an elderly gentleman who for years would have a team of Percherons in the local parades, threshing shows, etc. They were a beautiful and huge pair of stallions! Never minded being strapped next to each other, never squealed, it was just "normal" for them to work in this manner. I know, it isn't the norm but it was awesome to see those two horses in dress harness with their ancient owner showing them off! biggrin.gif And he did all the training too--he had stories to tell from way back when......

Tracy
Mesadagirl
Is there anyone reading this particular string of posts, who show Arabs in hand, and use plastic bags, shakers etc. who is proud of the fact? Anyone of them brave enough to come forward to stand up for this type of show preperation? Willing to post with thier name and the reason they perpetuate this practice? huh.gif

Is there anyone guilty of making noise in the stands at a show for a particular entry? sad.gif (I am personally guilty of this) Anyone who has been shushed or asked to leave for coaching or handling from the side lines? A parent, coach, trainer, owner, breeder, friend or relative etc. who hasn't given "loud advice" from the stands?(me again ohmy.gif )

I know personally why I have contributed to the "bad stuff" at a show. Although I have never been shushed or asked to leave. It is hard to see one of my girls in the ring, needing some help, and refraining from helping when I am NOT the only one doing it. No, this is not a good enough reason to keep doing it! I think the pressure to win and do well are the reasons I will have had this lapse in "horse show etiqutte". I take full responsibility for my behaviour. dry.gif

As for the rest of you, who else is willing to be honest and share thier reasons?

Sheri wink.gif
(a very bad mom and coach)
lionsdenfarm
What I hated about the cheering at the shows was that if an entry had a lot of people in the crowd, they had a lot of cheers! smile.gif That was usually from a big farm. If the entry was a small farm or owner, they really didnt have anyone cheering for them unless they drug along some "help" from home. wink.gif It seems if the crowd is going to cheer upon entry of the horses to the ring, then all horses should get some cheering. It makse sense to cheer for your horse of course but be polite and cheer for the others too.

Kind of goes hand in hand with good sportsmanship--I think we need to be good sports (I know, bad judges all the time it seems huh.gif ) but to give a congratulations and not throwing a tantrum for not winning what you thought you deserve can go a long way.

Tracy
paelmchen
I completely agree with Hansi, Karen & Nikki.

But there is a chance to do it in my opinion "the other way" more in a true horsemenship direction, showing the versatility of our breed.

I´m very proud to say that in germany we already have two arabian horse-events, where it is the "other way".
Salzkotten & since 2006 also Blankenheim, you have the combination of breeding-show classes, combined with ridden classes, giving the competitors the chance of being the champion of both !

The show classes are judged in the english-system, and commented by Diether von Kleist, executiv-secretary of the VZAP.

This is an alternativ way to represent the breed, and we had so many exhibitors that had left the SHOW-SCENE, they came and showed their horses again.

The number of entry´s speaks a clear language, and we will go on that way.

ciao roland palm

winner of the combination, show & riding:

Shameer(Sindibad x Maishiwa)
Click to view attachmentClick to view attachment

gelding-champion & third of the combination:
El Kaishaar(Estopa Son x Amun Kaishaga)
Click to view attachment
HLM
Dear cheri, Tracy, roland and all.

Firt of all, horses in harness next to each other-stallions-, that is a different story. Babolna often drives "5 inhand" they are harnessed so that they can not get to each other readily.

I get hundreds of e-mails and reply to each one. Most all are of my opinion that we must bring things back to normal in the showring, give eerybody a chance and have the wellknown trainers/handlers maintain ethics.
Indeed large farms have their huge crowd through their clients who all scream at once. Our smaller breeders dont. I am not saying that Judges are influenced by this - I certainly would not be- but it does distract.

Yes, may expression could be considered blunt or even harsh at times. But this is how I am- and can not change nor do I intend to.
Sometimes tapping is overlooked and sludge hammers have to be used.

I always appreciate anybody standing up for the right thing, speaking up and defending the matter.At least we all can agree to disagree and it is not personal by enlarge.

As long as we have people who hide under "Guest" and are most likely those who also talk behind people's back, we can not improve. all should say what they think and should not be afraid. this is the only way were we all can come to a common agreement, like give a little, take a little.

I was just informed that our Association here wants to delete the performance point stystem for Halter entries. Obviously there is a good reason. Such should be rebuffed at all costs.

Roland, I would have loved to attend the shows you mentioned and am so glad to understand that there is a sincere "try" to bring shows into a better
light, that they help all of us maintaining good and gallant horemenship, something we can teach our young ones "firmly". Once all follow suit it will be a plasure to show and indeed will regain many of our people.

All have a wonderful day
Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
Guest
QUOTE (Guest @ Oct 6 2006, 03:09 PM)
Yes Hansi we know your saying about the shoe fitting, only you seem to think that it fits everyone who doesn't take your shoe size. You think, and always will think, that your opinion is the only correct one, and that you have the right to attack people because they see things differently. That is what annoys people, and stops them reading your posts. They rather take advice from people who also have a lot of experience and knowlegde, but share it in a less aggressive and assertive way. Often you just shout out your opinion again and again like you're wearing blinkers, but you don't want to actually discuss things objectively, trying to understand those who have a different opinion (which would be better than just ignoring them or implying that they are simply stupid). Now that's a pity, because that would be much more educational. Talking WITH instead of talking AT people.

I'm not saying this to hurt you, but I just hope you might one day try to see how your words come across, and that you could share your experience in a more effective way if you treated your fellow forum members in a normal way, not as silly little first-graders who don't know one end  of a horse from the other.
*


QUOTE (Guest @ Oct 6 2006, 04:00 PM)
O.K. forget it, I should have known better than to believe you might be interested in anyone's opinion except your own. Oh well, I suppose everyone has to get a kick out of life in some way - if this is yours, then I'm a little sad for you, but I wish you the best of it.
*


I agree with everything you just posted, Guest, but unfortunately, your words fall on Hansi's deaf ears. blink.gif IMO, she doesn't care what many of us members have politely been trying to say, and those not-so-politely try to say, about how she comes across to others and never will. sad.gif If we sign our names we get attacked, if we don't sign our names we get attacked. unsure.gif When she was gone for a while because she caused quite a stir, it was a huge relief to see her gone. smile.gif But I must admit when she came back I was pleasantly surprised she was more dignified manner and actually "nice" and I did enjoy reading her posts (however, they were being monitored). smile.gif But as usual, it didn't last long and here we go again. dry.gif

I have many positive mentors in my life in the Arabian horse world community and will continue to surround myself with them. biggrin.gif However, because of Hansi's posts I am now joining our beloved "Ralph" and will no longer post on SE.com. Goodbye folks! sad.gif
Marilee
Dear Guest--Then you also won't be able to read that I showed some of The Black Stallion movie (still inspiring after 27 years!!!) to 5th and kindergarten students here at school today, read some of Little Black and The Black Stallion books, talked about the wild horse adoption and show this weekend here in Las Vegas and invited them, and invited them to the Las Vegas Farm Festival in 2 weeks, or how I called The Pyramid Society today to renew my dues and to announce the upcoming meeting here in Las Vegas in April to brainstorm and share ideas about our Egyptian Arabians (and share pedigrees and pictures and videos).

I hope that any newcomers reading this thread understand that even though we own these wonderful horses, we are all proud individuals, willing to debate and defend our positions. In all breeds there is debate over training, showing, which bloodlines for halter/performance....We would hope that you would consider an Egyptian Arabian. Just like the Black Stallion movie, our horses are spirited (like the movie Spirit!), but also loyal and athletic. Look around at many different breeds and we hope you will come back to us, Arabians with Egyptian pedigrees.

Ralph--I do miss your posts of dressage and bloodlines! smile.gif smile.gif
Nadj al Nur
Good for you Marilee. Everything starts with the little kids, even tho they may not own a horse for years. When they do start looking for a horse, they will remember what you told them.
Cathy
Georgia
Hello Guests and all,
I really don't think any of you would disagree with Hansi on the points she makes about the Arabian breed with proven "doing" horses out there, would be a better and healthier breed?, than the status quo? smile.gif .
Hansi and I have butted heads a few times, but we both are on the same page when it comes to the things she believes the strongest about and is all good for our breed. with many decades gone by and nothing is any different only worse, Class C, and B shows are gone, Class A Shows are dying a painful death, we have no middle recreational users of our wonderful breed, because frankly we just don't have the horses out there with the miles on them.. I think she is well within her rights to get a little pushy.

As far as improvement of a breed and sportsmanship, I would highly recommend any and all watch a Standardbred race. I love watching the races and the
horsemanship that you can see going on and we are talking about trainers going for millions. God forbid our professional trainers would be going for that sort of money, with how they conduct themselves now and treat their horses without.

Of course accidents happen, equipment fails, mistakes are made, and sometimes there's a bad egg out there, but all and all the racing is very clean with the utmost respect and care going on by these professionals and the people are very helpful and really promote newcomers. I was involved in this breed for many years, I was a show horse, riding horse breeder that showed up at the track with the horses her husband had bought her, as he got tired of me spending a thousand dollars and coming home with a blue ribbon or not. tongue.gif I had some big time STB trainers that helped me, trained with me and the ultimate was being asked to warm up a horse for them before a race, as they had several going in a short time span, even they would do the same for me not charging a dime. I was always welcomed on training days to train in crowds getting the horses use to close quarters and control, teaching young horses to pass and be passed, leave the gate or come from behind the pack. I can only hope some day just a little of that family feeling comes to the Arabian breed and may the best horse win no matter how much money is in your pocket or cover girl make up you own. It was one of the best and most fun experiances of my life. As a teenager, my mom gave me riding lessons for Christmas present on the only farm in town a Saddlebred farm. My mom didn't have any money, and they hauled me and an extra horse to all the shows for several years treating me as one of their own kids. I asked my mom what they charged her and she said other than my weekly lesson nothing. They pinned my instructors habit to fit me. Mom bought me a derby and boot. They formed me as a horseman, had I had to have money to pay them for this, I wouldn't be. I hope and pray for people like this everyday in the Arabian breed.

Take care all

Georgia
Cheryl L
Well on a positive note the AHA has created the Arabian Community Shows (ACS). These are nice arabian shows with a multitude of classes. The cost is not prohibitive either. Our EMAA (Eastern Michigan Arabian Association) shows are now ACS. These are 2 day shows. The stall fee is $35 for the weekend and the classes are around $8 per class with Championship classes being a tad bit more. Now that it is an ACS we also have to add an extra $5. No big deal. These are very competitive shows and the competition is very deep. They offer a great selection of classes from Halter, Sport horse, Dressage, your various hunt and show hack and English Pleasure, Westerm classes and all of the Amateur classes and a ton of youth classes too. We do go by AHA rules. As you can tell I like the show, it is a lot of fun and the people are great. It is a great place for people to learn about the different disciplines and does not cost a ton of money.
Cheryl
HLM
Dear Cheryl

Thank you for your post, these are wonderful news. this now will give many of our people a chance to show againa and have fun. At the same time display the beautiful Arbian horses for what they have known for since day one.

so well do I remember the wonderful shows at Rochester, NY, Detroit, MI, Toldeo,Ohio (Buckeye) Washington, Muncie,Indiana, etc- all eastern shows and the wonderful horsemenship displayed and the great hospitality we Canadians received. At that time it was not that easy to cross the border, sometimes took hours before the USDA Vets arrived, just the same we suported the shows for many years. In 1972 I won every highpoint award there was in the State of New York and Province of Ontario, always having about a dozen SEs in our show string. Never, at any time did we hear of an ugly remark, instead were congratulated and when the Americans came to show at our shows in Ontario, we did all we could to facilitate them as well. We had mostly American Judges, which included Bazy Tankersley, Bill Trap, Max Culpepper, etc.etc.
who all did a wonderful job. I have many films-turned into videos with the help of Col.Tom Tickton- displaying some of such shows.

There was Ev Shea with his great,beautiful Desert Sands and the Lancer horses, Ruminaja horses, Rookers, Hillcrest, etc.etc. and we all became good friends but also respected each others horses, regardless of bloodlines.
At that time ony we-Serenity- had SEs competing-which drew a lot of attention.
That induced some to also aquire SEs, such as Ruminaja, Lancers, etc.

the greatest fun we had was at country fairs, and at such many people got enticed and lateron aquired an SE. Mind you, at that time there were very few SEs available and seldom one for sale. Only Gleannloch had here and there a weanling available.
As years passed-from the early nineties on, people showed less and less and we all know the reasons. Focus was now given to flat racing and competitive
trail, and some endurance races. The SEs which flat raced did very well
Gleannoch, Serenity, Imperial, became formidable competitors towards other bloodlines. Fahleh++, his son Asjah Ibn Faleh, ZT Ali Baba, Serenity IbnKHofo, Serenity Mamlouk, etc. were difficult to defeat and made an impact.

Most of the time I remind "test your horses" and stated many times that this can be done at home. Horsemen/woman know what to test for and breed accordingly. I know of numerous breeders who put their horses through a lot at home to ascertain their qualities, which you can only recognize when on top of them.

Most all of my opinions are based on experiences, remembering the results, good or bad,never forgetting the formidable competitors of other bloodlines, which is the majority in this world, and always respecting them.

when you all go through the records you will see many SEs with the "++" or "+++"behind their name, having earned the Legion of merit or supreme Legion of merit awards. How many do we see during the past ten years? Yet many could earn it. I pray that we will see this again for years to come. when the SEs again run for the roses.

All have a nice day
Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian farms
CenturyOak
Wow.. I've not had time to read all of this thread but just from the first few posts let me also recommend a three word solution which I see (after posting initially lol) that Cheryl has already mentioned and others may have as well.

Arabian. Community. Shows.

These are family based, 1 day open shows where people can come show in a smaller show environment.. against other moms and dads and kids.. and without all the hype, hollering, crazed horses and disappointed spectators of many of the bigger shows.

Our state association has had 2 of these and both were very good successes... We were not blown out with entries at the first show, but we had owners of Arabian horses that have shown at all the other venues besides Arabian shows come out to enjoy their horses with peers and friends. The second show we had nearly 150 entries.. and a whole lot more folks that had not ever shown their arabians in an arabian type show. These horses were shown in all disciplines from Halter, to Hunter, to Western to Costume and even Timed Events.

The comments I heard? Here's just a sampling..

"Wow, what beautiful horses!"

"Look at that little girl and that Arabian gelding, he's watching out for her and listening to everything she asks"

"I love how Arabians can be so pretty and snorty, yet come right back and be so quiet and mannerly.. that's incredible"

"I never realized Arabians could be great kids horses"

and my favorite

"I always loved how Arabians looked in the magazines, I am so thrilled to finally get to meet them up close.. they are so personable!" That last one from the lady who was standing next to Zandai Jasoor, my 3 year old SE stallion, rubbing his tongue while his eyes closed and he won over a new convert.


Now, I realize Europe may not have these types of shows as yet, but they are here in the states.. and slowly but surely the perception of the Arabian horse will change IF we get out there and show them to the public in a way that highlights the great things about this breed, their talents, their manners, their trainability and their inherent abilities with children. This change will come from the ground up, not from the sky down. So get out there with your Arabians at these smaller shows, support them and start changing some minds. The opportunity is there.. you simply have to seize it and start making changes in your own small way wub.gif

The scales will be rebalanced one pebble at a time.. won't you put your pebble in to help?



Gosh that sounds like a Sally Fields commercial blink.gif laugh.gif
HLM
Dear Century Oaks

I like the Sally fields commercials, ha.

Yes, this is how it all once started and proved to be so successfull.
this is how the Qhorses bring their young ones up.


Its like going to a kindergarden, then public school and then college,
and each phase experieces are gained. Such eventually will give some of our young ones the chance to go into higher competition.

But it might also be a good idea to get some together for a trail ride,and experienced rider in front and back and the pee-wees in the center, on well mannered horses. Yes, thee is so much we can do.

Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
paelmchen
Yes we do......

Blankenheim Event 2006 organized by VZAP under the lead of Daniela & Roland Palm

The pee wee biggrin.gif biggrin.gif classes:
paelmchen
Second try with the pictures:

Yes we do......

Blankenheim Event 2006 organized by VZAP under the lead of Daniela & Roland Palm

The pee wee biggrin.gif biggrin.gif classes:
Click to view attachmentClick to view attachmentClick to view attachment

ciao Roland Palm
Georgia
Hi Cheryl and Century Oak,

How do you go about finding out when these shows are? Does AHA keep a calendar or would you need to contact local clubs? I live in Ohio, but also close to Western Pennsylvania and Northern West Virginia. These shows are something I'd like to volunteer for and help out. Sounds like they are what the Class C and B shows used to be.

Do they have walk trot classes for over 50? tongue.gif or a Jack Benny class? biggrin.gif
Jack Benny is getting reallllllly old. rolleyes.gif I might even take my old trail mare for fun.

We used to have a great time, when the Little Buckeye would come to the Hilliard Fairgrounds in Columbus Ohio, were we trained our Race horses. I would pull our Fadjur daughter off the field, spend a week teaching all the kids that wanted to give it a whirl to ride, or show showmanship (what quick learners they are) spend all night cleaning her up and she would win ribbons for all the kids in the barn from lead line to English pleasure classes. She was always the talk of the track and the highlight of all the trainers kids, of the summer. All Good memories and wishing that on a new generation of Arabian owners. Hard to tell how many riding or horse owners we made over the years. I know they all had to appreciate an Arabian horse, as she was a gem.

Very interested in hearing more.

Georgia
HLM
Dear Roland and all

to my eyes there is nothing more beautiful than see the "Pee-wees" on an SE Arabian horse. It just brings tears to my eyes for joy. these little ones try their hearts out, look so determined and proud and just love their fourlegged partner.

I just wish the PS would have a class or two for them, like the Qhorse industry does.

I just wonder what it would take to have such classes inaugorated at PS. I would not mind sponsoring one "Pee-Wee"and may be others would follow suit?

May be some cant afford the attire, and may be some of us could provide some.
Or may be even a horse to ride.

Can you just see them and their proud parents? Yes folks, that is our future we must promote and treasure.

thank you Roland for your and your Wife's promoting them, and of course those darling photos.
that alone will tell others how much these horses look after the "pee-wees".

Have a grand day
Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms


Hansi
Georgia
Show bill from QH fun /open family show:
********
I tried to highlight certain things, but didn't turn out.. but in reading this "QH show bill, is the Jackpot classes $1000 pay out, beginner and novice classes and that means beginner horses too! The pricing still beats our family shows. this show is open to all breeds. Fun classes like egg and spoon, they may be silly, but you learn alot about yourself and horsemanship during these fun things, It also how horses get used, used, used and become the do anything family horse.
*******
There is a short Stats on the QH Congress at bottom - an industry worthy of modeling something after...

If you have a show bill you can post of the AHA family shows or send to me
via a personal PM, would be appreciated. Thanks, Georgia

2006 Western Pennsylvania Quarter Horse Association
WPQHA OPEN HORSE SHOW
JUNE 17, 2006
WPQHA Show Complex
Harlansburg, Pennsylvania
Show Starts at 9:00 AM Special Stall Fees: $25 for Week-end - RV Hook Ups: $25 for Week-end
2006 show approved by PQHA Open Point Shows, NEOHA (Dusty Boots Riding Club)
*******Good Food on Grounds****Good Parking******Good Stalls********Good RV Hook Ups*******
Come Join In The Fun For The Week-End Family, Friends & WPQHA
June 17th Open Show June 16th Barrels & Pole Bending Events
JUNE 17TH WPQHA Clinic for Horse & Rider 6pm - Open to All Horses/Riders/Spectators
$1000 Added in Jackpot Classes
Three High Point & Three Reserve High Point Awards Walk-Trot (10 & Under) (11-15 ) (16yrs & Over)
June 17th Open Show ENTRY FEES:: Class Fees Only: $5.00 per class Jackpot Classes: $10.00
Awards & Money Paybacks : 1st - $5.00 - 2nd - $3.00 - 3rd - $ 2.00
$ Class # 30 - $10.00 fee Dusty Boots Club Class Only –Results Given @ Futurity Show – Monies Paid Out There $
* Jackpot Classes: 7 Entries Payback - Five Places - Less than 7 Entries Payback - Three Places
Judge: Daren Wright - Chillicothe, Ohio
1A *OPEN JACKPOT SHOWMANSHIP 21. Walk-Trot Horsemanship (10 & Under – E & W )
1. Showmanship ( 16 & Over) 22. Novice Rider Walk-Trot Pleasure (11 & Over – E & W )
2. Youth Showmanship ( 15 & Under ) 23. Walk-Trot Pleasure ( 10 & Under – E & W )
3. Beginners Showmanship 24. Walk-Trot Egg & Spoon (10 & Under & Novice – E & W
4. Novice Rider Walk-Trot Showmanship ( 11 & Over ) ******INTERMISSION – (At Least 15 Minutes )*****
5. Walk-Trot Showmanship (10 & Under) 25. W/T Trail ( 10 & Under & Novice – E & W )
6. Showmanship ( 30 & Over ) 26. Open Trail ( E&W )
7. Colt Halter (2 yrs. & Under ) 27. Beginners Western Horsemanship
8. Youth Halter ( 18 yrs & Under ) 28. Open Egg & Spoon (E&W) (Year End Only)
9. Registered Quarter Horse Halter 29. Beginners Western Pleasure
10. All Breed Halter ( No Registered Quarter Horses) 30. $ PROGRESSIVE WESTERN PLEASURE
11. Lead Line ( Riders 6 & under ) 31A *OPEN JACKPOT WESTERN PLEASURE
*****************10 MINUTE BREAK************** 31. Open Jr. Western Pleasure ( 5yrs & Under )
12. English Equitation (16 & Over ) 32. Registered Quarter Horse Western Pleasure
13. English Equitation (15 & Under ) 33. All Breed Western Pleasure Class (No Reg. Quarter Horses)
14. Beginners English Equitation 34A *OPEN JACKPOT WESTERN HORSEMANSHIP
15A *OPEN JACKPOT ENGLISH PLEASURE 34. Western Horsemanship (15 yrs & Under )
15. English Pleasure ( 16 yrs & Over ) 35. Western Horsemanship ( 16 yrs & Over )
16. English Pleasure ( 15 yrs & Under ) 36. 30 & Over Horsemanship / Equitation (E & W)
17. Beginners English Pleasure 37. Open Senior Pleasure ( 6yrs & Over – ( E & W )
18. Hunter Hack (16 & Over ) 38. Western Pleasure ( 15yrs & Under )
19. Hunter Hack (15 & Under) 39. Western Pleasure ( 16 yrs & Over )
*****************10 MINUTE BREAK************** 40. 30 & Over Pleasure ( E & W )
20. Novice Rider Walk-Trot Horsemanship(11 & Over) ( E &W)
Class Awards in Each Class Sponsored By Rome Feed, Inc. Jeff & Laurie Jones & Family
WPQHA officers, show secretary, and/or show manager reserve the right to expel exhibitors who demonstrate unsportsmanlike conduct and/or inhumane treatment of
horses and will report cases of abuse.
WPQHA is not responsible for lost, damaged, or stolen articles or injury to horses, exhibitors, or spectators
FOR INFORMATION & STALL, RV HOOKS- CONTACT:
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2006 Western Pennsylvania Quarter Horse Association
WPQHA OPEN HORSE SHOW
JUNE 16, 2005
WPQHA Show Complex
Harlansburg, Pennsylvania
Show Starts at 6:00 PM Special Stall Fees: $25 for Week-end - RV Hook Ups: $25 for Week-end
June 16th Barrels & Pole Bending Events
June 16th Open Show ENTRY FEES:: Class Fees Only: $5.00 per class
Awards & Money Paybacks : 1st - $5.00 - 2nd - $3.00 - 3rd - $ 2.00
5 PM Exhibition Barrels Pay at Gate $2.00 Per Run
39. Mini Barrels (10 & under)
40. Adult Barrels ( over 18 )
41. Youth Barrels ( 18 & Under )
42. Beginner Horse/Pony Barrels
( Beginner Animals Only )
43. Mini Poles (10 & under)
44. Adult Poles ( over 18 )
45. Youth Poles ( 18 & Under )
46. Beginner Horse/Pony Poles
( Beginner Animals Only )
Class Awards in Each Class Sponsored By Rome Feed, Inc. Jeff & Laurie Jones & Family
WPQHA officers, show secretary, and/or show manager reserve the right to expel exhibitors who demonstrate unsportsmanlike conduct and/or inhumane treatment of horses
and will report cases of abuse.
WPQHA is not responsible for lost, damaged, or stolen articles or injury to horses, exhibitors, or spectators
FOR INFORMATION & STALL, RV HOOKS- CONTACT:
Pat Fuchs, 219 Leech Rd., Greenville, PA 16125 Phone: 724-588-6010 « Fax: 724-588-0948
Show Grounds Office (During Office Hours Only ) : 724-652-0206
Website: www.wpqha.com

All American Quarter Horse Congress
Related Entries
 Columbus
 Ohio State Fair
The All American Quarter Horse Congress began in 1967. The Ohio Quarter Horse Association founded this event and continues to sponsor it to this day. The congress's purpose is to showcase the American Quarter Horse. The organizers also hope to educate people about this mammal and the proper way to show it at professional events.

****(thought this was interesting)**** would be great to see a fee arab reiner or cutting horses in this****
While the Ohio Quarter Horse Association does permit other breeds of horses to participate in the congress, the event's main purpose is to showcase the American Quarter Horse.

The All American Quarter Horse Congress takes place for three weeks each October at the Ohio Expo Center in Columbus, Ohio.
The Ohio Quarter Horse Association estimates that 650,000 people attend the congress each year. This event rivals the Ohio State Fair in attendance. The participants of the All American Quarter Horse Congress also bring an estimated 110 million dollars to the Central Ohio economy. More than 16,000 horses enter various competitions each year, and approximately 8,500 of these mammals reside at the fairgrounds during the congress.
Cheryl L
You can go onto the AHA website and they do have a section about the ACS. I believe that you can do a search by state, don't know for sure though. The nice thing is that the horse accumulates points in these shows. Our ACS is a 2 day show and sooo much fun. Everyone should check it out.
Cheryl
paelmchen
2 Day´s fun at Blankenheim, and the "Pee wees" feel in love with their gelding champion

El Kaishaar(Estopa Son x Amun Kaishaga)

Showtime:
Click to view attachment

after the show and in the childrens classes the "Pee Wees" best friend!
Click to view attachmentClick to view attachmentClick to view attachmentClick to view attachment
paelmchen
For Hansi

& all the posters who understand the german language, you find a report about the activities at the VZAP website.

http://www.araberzuchtverband.de/vzap-neu/...nland/index.htm

click Nachrichten on the left side , there you´ll find the report!

Hansi we set all the pedigrees of the horses in this report biggrin.gif biggrin.gif wink.gif

ciao roland palm
HLM
Dear Roland

thank you. Unbelivable georgeous.O how I wish we would have this here at the PS and some other areas and shows. that's the way to go.

By the way a "Pee-wee"is a little one- sort of age 4-8-

As far as all english reading posters/friends are concerned, look at the
website Roland mentioned and on the right hand side is "Nachrichten".
Punch in the second or last one and you will see absolutely fantastic photos.

The first one "Nachrichten" gives you the names of the entires and you will see many SEs mentioned.

thanks again and have a nice day
Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
Cheryl L
They used to have youth classes at the event, but, once again there were few entries. The last time I remember was 6 years ago and watched a lovely young man ride his SE gelding. There was only one other in the class. Even at our local fair, we have to have at least 6 entries in a class. If they dwindle below that for several years, they too will be eliminated.
Cheryl
Georgia
What a wonderful gelding, absolutely beautiful and absolutely Arabian! biggrin.gif

Thanks for posting the pee-wee pictures, they are wonderful

Georgia
Guest(LauraHM)
Advertise on Animal Planet during a popular show, or adv during shows such as Saddle Club what great family and trail horses arabians can be. Show that they can make good lesson horses! My riding instructor thinks SEAs would not be safe for lessons.
Laura HM
(In too much of a hurry right now to log in- gotta go)

Laura HM
lynnbrook
Hansi ,
I know this is off topic . But I thought you would be interested to hear Danny is riding Asha who is by Thee Infidel & out of Minstrils Lyric a The Minstril daughter who won 2 top five & a top Ten at the 2006 Egyptian Event. If she isn't sold by the time the 2007 Egyptian Event rolls around Danny will be showing her in halter & under saddle & a friends daughter may ride her in the ATR/JTR classes. More than likely she will be western.

Here shortly we are suppose to get in a True Colors stallion in for under saddle training . He will going to the Event for halter & under saddle classes.

If you want to see more SE under saddle in the show ring owners need to be willing to send the SE out for under saddle training for more than 3 or 4 months. & be willing to let the trainer take them to more shows under saddle than just the Egyptian Event.

Donna
Basilisk
Going back to the beginning of this thread and how to improve the image and saleability of the Arabian:

Here in the UK, up to about 10 years or so ago, the primary focus of Arabian showing was in county shows, ie, large agricultural shows where all breeds of horses could be seen and compared on the same day. To some extent, this is still true, but since the arrival of the screaming audience, the win-at-all-costs mentality, and the ludicrous grooming/showing styles, there is no doubt that we have lost the sympathy and the interest of the British equestrian world at large, who are now more likely to turn to the coloured cob and the 'novelty' breeds such as the QH and the PRE as a first choice of a 'safe' family horse.

It is interesting that the largest single show for youngsters in the UK (and possibly the whole of Europe) - Ponies UK - this year tried out an experiment of judging some "fun" championships by clap/screamometer. The entire idea was resoundingly rejected, with many angry letters in the equestrian press (as well as comments at the show), and resulted in calls for the organiser whose idea it was to resign!

There is no doubt that many people within our breed across the world are sick of the hype that has taken over Arabian showing (see also the thread here on the Jordan show, and Princess Alia's remarks about getting back to the commensense style of showing). If our own people loathe it so much, it is hardly surprising that people from *outside* the Arabian horse world are so put off by it!

The way to improve the market for the Arabian is to improve the image of the breed. We (collectively) need to stop being so "up ourselves" and start communicating that the Arabian is the perfect family horse by SHOWING IT PUBLICALLY AS SUCH.

I am not advocating showing horses that appear half dead, as is the current stock horse fashion. But as those of us who have been around the breed for some time know, it is perfectly possible to show the liveliness, intelligence and spirit of the Arabian without the hype, the ludicrous face shaving, the outright gamesmanship and all the other current fads that at times make the Arabian showring look like a cheap night-club.

Hansi is perfectly right in saying that we need to prove to people what the Arabian can do under saddle. Here in the UK, we have a situation where people have 'voted with their feet': in-hand classes are struggling to make double figures even at European qualifying shows, whereas the riden classes are now booming!

But here in Europe, I would say the answer is NOT in all-Arabian shows, but for Arabians to take on all-comers in open classes at all types of shows. To get people to come to an all-Arabian show, they already have to have some interest in the breed: seeing Arabians being safe, sensible, accomplished riding horses in the context of an open breed show is the spark that will ignite that interest.

Keren
Ulla


After reading this I think we are driving newcomers away when we are not able to talk to each other in a polite way and respecting different opinions than our own. To tolerate each other is the first and most important step to bring newcomers to our breed! biggrin.gif
An Arabian horse is much loved and respected first and foremost for its wonderful disposition. We should follow and develope the very same attitiude like our horses....
CenturyOak
Georgia,

The ACS shows are listed on the AHA site. Each one is sponsored by an affiliated club, in my case the Alabama Arabian Horse Association.. and they make up their own class list appropriate for the interest that area. For example, we have very few if any Saddleseat or English Please/Park classes due to there being a shortage of these types of horses in the area. Now saying that, if someone shows up with a EP horse we'd be more than happy to add the class so they can show smile.gif The only stipulations from AHA is that 60% of the classes have to be Arabian or Half Arabian only, and the rest is pretty much wide open.

I can email you our class list when I get home today, although it does need alot of work. Putting one of these together is harder than you'd think lol I am hoping this year (2007) to add some SHIH classes at least to go along with the halter classes we offered.

The whole show is a one day affair, usually around 60 classes or so although we added ALOT of classes for our last show due to demand, that was fine.. we had alot of entries there too biggrin.gif I truly think this is a great great thing for the Arabian breed and YES I'm out there DOING this with my Straight Egyptians!!
K2A
QUOTE (Ulla @ Oct 9 2006, 03:20 PM)


After reading this I think we are driving newcomers away when we are not able to talk to each other in a polite way and respecting different opinions than our own. To tolerate each other is the first and most important step to bring newcomers to our breed!  biggrin.gif
An Arabian horse is much loved and respected first and foremost for its wonderful disposition. We should follow and develope the very same attitiude like our horses....
*

This is where the problem lies. Negativity, drives good people away.
Guest
Hi Hansi, I would like to take issue about Bob Hart, Jr. People have observed this guy sewing a stallion before a show. I know this for a fact.


I can also not remember that our great trainers such as Tom McNair, Rhita McNair, Stan White, Morris Wingold, Sheyla Varian, Bob Hart Sr and Junior,etc,etc,etc
ever showed and behaved in this fashion. That would have been beneith them.

Have a nice day
Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
*

[/quote]
Guest
I like going to the county fairs and have seen Standardbred races. Unlike other races where the horse is ridden, there can be a wide distance between the horses as they near the finish line. When the last horse is so hopelessly outclassed and the driver keeps whipping it, this is so sad to watch.




As far as improvement of a breed and sportsmanship, I would highly recommend any and all watch a Standardbred race. I love watching the races and the
horsemanship that you can see going on and we are talking about trainers going for millions. God forbid our professional trainers would be going for that sort of money, with how they conduct themselves now and treat their horses without.
Georgia
HLM
Dear Ulla

I dont think so, driving people away because of some way posts are written.
Many newcommers or the young ones dont read the forums. They go by what their eyes see and their ears hear.

Hansi biggrin.gif
Serenity Arabian Farms
Marilee
I will be talking up this forum (straightegyptians.com) a lot next week and in the coming months here in Las Vegas to newcomers and to children. There are some very progressive ideas on this website and they need to be shared with nonbelievers.
Kimberli Nelson
I was asked to judge an open show this last Sunday. There were 90 people showing 110 horses. It was all breed but of the 110 horses there were 21 Arabians with 3 of those Egyptian 2 were SO. It was a wonderful show. The Arabians did well, move beautifully and were eager to work. They were exciting to watch. Not one Arabian was a jerk unlike some of the other breeds.

You wont see these wins listed in the DataSource but they were there and competing in all classes from Halter to jumping, englidh and pleasure and equation. These Arabians competed in all classes. it was really something to see.
Georgia
QUOTE (Guest @ Oct 11 2006, 06:06 AM)
I like going to the county fairs and have seen Standardbred races.  Unlike  other races where the horse is ridden, there can be a wide distance between the horses as they near the finish line.  When the last horse is so hopelessly outclassed and the driver keeps whipping it, this is so sad to watch.
As far as improvement of a breed and sportsmanship, I would highly recommend any and all watch a Standardbred race. I love watching the races and the
horsemanship that you can see going on and we are talking about trainers going for millions. God forbid our professional trainers would be going for that sort of money, with how they conduct themselves now and treat their horses without.
Georgia

*


Well, then you saw the one bad apple. You are not allowed to out and out hit a STB race horse, you must hit the shafts of the cart, if you want to get their attention. They have excessive whipping rules. thot doesn't mean they don't use the whip, but not in a abusive way.
Also, if there are welts on any STB
the drivers are put down for several days and also fined $250 +, maybe more now. You watch the professionals going for the million dollars you won't find any better class of people and horses. Watch the Little Brown Jug or the Hamiltonian on TV. If you are caught with so much as a needle in your trunk you can get 10 years to life banned from racing. Is it worth the risk, never was for me.. This is all to protect the intregrity of the breed and assures owners, trainers, and fans are getting a fair shake. There are the bad apples out there- the desparate ones, but if they get caught and believe me they are looking (not like our shows), they get some hefty fines and up to life suspensions. Something the Arabian or any horse related industry needs is strict regulations from abuse and fraud and assure the intregrity of the breed. That doesn't mean all is perfect, but at least they have rules and people who are not afraid to enforce them.


I've liked reading this thread.. very good everyone.

Georgia
Guest
I'm afraid there was more than just one bad apple. A lot of drivers were whipping their horses. The sound of the whip on their flanks just made me cringe. And I know for sure it wasn't landing on the shafts of the cart but the horse. This was just a small county fair, but there are some high up races run at this time. Maybe the rules don't apply to small tracks, but ths is just so sickening - when the horse bringing up the rear is trying as hard as it can and is many lengths behind yet the driver keeps on whipping that horse again and again and again.


QUOTE (Georgia @ Oct 12 2006, 02:56 AM)
Well, then you saw the one bad apple.  You are not allowed to out and out hit a STB race horse, you must hit the shafts of the cart, if you want to get their attention.  They have excessive whipping rules.  thot doesn't mean they don't use the whip, but not in a abusive way.
Also, if there are welts on any STB
the drivers are put down for several days and also fined $250 +, maybe more now.  You watch the professionals going for the million dollars you won't find any better class of people and horses.  Watch the Little Brown Jug or the Hamiltonian on TV.  If you are caught with so much as a needle in your trunk you can get 10 years to life banned from racing. Is it worth the risk, never was for me.. This is all to protect the intregrity of the breed and assures owners, trainers, and fans are getting a fair shake.  There are the bad apples out there- the desparate ones, but if they get caught and believe me they are looking (not like our shows), they get some hefty fines and up to  life suspensions.  Something the Arabian or any horse related industry needs is strict regulations from abuse and fraud and assure the intregrity of the breed.  That doesn't mean all is perfect, but at least they have rules and people who are not afraid to enforce them.
I've liked reading this thread.. very good everyone.

Georgia
*
al buraaq
After reading this thread I would like to add some observations.

.

I have shown Stallion Halter AOTH at the event several times with as many as 25 stallions in the class and never has there been any kind of incidence that could be described as dangerous. A testament to the Egyptian Horse and their Amateur owners both trusting each other. Can any other breed compare?

As for alternatives to Class A shows I have attended "Pony Express Shows" sponsored by Arabian Clubs. They are inexpensive, family oriented, fun shows, and fun classes. Grand Parents to very young children all having a great time. While having a few trainers present with clients these shows were dominated by families that had trained their own horses. They were as happy and excited with a sixth place ribbon as a first place ribbon. And guess what there was money involved with the wins!

I have found some behaviour of so called trainers despicable inside and outside the arena in Class A shows. One has to give the Pyramid Society credit for policing and implementing the ginger test and monitoring abuse in the ring and out. This years show was generally peaceful with shanking and whipping nonexistent. It took a lot of hard work and persistence by Martha Lucas and others to bring some manners to the show. Too bad class A shows haven't caught up to the Egyptian Event.

Can we do a better job appealing to the newcomer. You bet.
Each of us has a responsibility to take an interested newcomer under our wing and be a testimonial for the positives of the breed. How many of us will take the time to visit with individuals touring the stalls at shows and talk about our horses? Too often there seems to be an aloofness that can be described as apathetic by some or they are qualifying the visitor as a buyer. They might not be that day or in the future. Is it a waste of time? For the breed absolutely not.

Frankly, I am annoyed by the negatives I hear about the industry, it is no different than any other industry and if you don't like what you see get involved and change within!

Mike
Marilee
Bravo, Mike. I USED to be very quiet and not outspoken. Now if I have an idea and others just "dissed" it, I do it myself. I agree that some people are negative or elitist. I am neither, so I try to use my energy in a positive way to attract more people to our Arabians and counter the negativity and abuse I see. If more of us speak up or refuse to show "in that way", perhaps there will be a change.


PS--I love your horses and the rider who you mention.
Susan Mayo
In my opinion the things that go on at A level shows do nothing to bring new people, true horsement, into the Arabian fold. I now only show dressage and Sporthorse because I refuse to do to my horses what has to be done even to show Western Pleasure. It is really ridiculous to watch the warm up arena, all the owners standing in the center in their silver dripping clothes while the trainers abuse their horses. Right before ring call, the owners jump aboard, go into the ring, and show. As soon as they exit, the trainers grab the horses and the owners are off for drinks. The poor horses are in distress totally. You rarely see one who is not snapping their teeth, swishing their tail and showing obvious signs of stress. I am talking about performance here, halter is just as bad but at least the handlers are not on their backs torturing them.

I ride and teach dressage and we don't even use martingales to achieve position and balance. My students are dumbfounded when we show Arabian shows and they see what is being done to the rail class horses. And at shows, nothing too drastic is being done. One look at the horses faces is all it takes. Even our horses get nervous in the warm up arenas because they see the panic in the (especiall English horses) and they don't understand.

A well traine Arabian that is correctly handled can easily be trained ridden and shown by an amature. I have students that I have started from scratch who have trained their own horses from first mounting to class A blues after as little as two years riding. Granted, they are doing it with instruction, but they are doing it themselves and they have sensible, loving horses who look forward to their work and are willing to try to please their owners. They win too.

Susan
Guest_carol_*
Well I was looking at a picture of a Bay english horse at the US natioals..
The horse looked haggard and his eye expression was aworried look.
His jaw was just about jammed into his neck because he had leather parafanalia wrapped tight around his neck seeming to keep his head in. If this is english pleasure..From that horses expression..It was no pleasure for him.
And whats with these tennessee walking horse type shoes on for????
Cheryl L
They do not allow "Tennessee Walker" shoes on Arabs. On Purebreds the foot length is 4 1/2 inches and there are regulations regarding pads. I can't remember what the hoof length for 1/2 Arabs are, but, they follow the same pad regulations too!. You do not see 6 inches of pads plus shoe on our horses. If you looked at the photo on another forum, that was a 3 year old that was being a big snot in the ring. I had watched his class online. Needless to say Dick caught a very candid shot. I know of no perfect horse or a perfect rider. I am a good rider and am sure that I could be caught having a bad day too.
Cheryl
Guest_carol_*
A perfect horse and a perfect rider??? Thats your opinion ,not mine...If my jaw was jamed into my neck, I,d be a snot to...By the way ,was that a 1/2 arab ?
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