Hello all !

I'm writting an article about the famous Ansata mare *Ansata Bint Bukra. I'd like YOU to share your opinions about him, his ancestors, his progeny, etc. Any comments I can include in my article are welcome !

Thanks for helping

Here's an additional list of question you may answer to :

Could you provide any photo of her, her ancestors or her progeny ?
Would you like me to include a contact for your Bint Bukra descent in the article ? If yes can you provide your adress, tel number, e-mail, URL, cell

How did you came through this line ?
Do you have any special story about your Bint Bukra horses ?
How do you consider this line in your herd ?
Could you give some general facts about Ansata Bint Bukra, her ancestors, her progeny ?
What are the typical caracteristics of Ansata Bint Bukra, her ancestors, her progeny ?
What were Ansata Bint Bukra, her ancestors, her progeny trained for ?
What did you achieve with your Bint Bukra horses ?
What do you plan for them in the future ?
Could you give some comments about Ansata Bint Bukra pedigree ?
What do you think about Ansata Bint Bukra's sire and dam ?
Who are the horses related to her you like most ?
Who are her most important descendants ?
What are the specificities that make her progeny interesting breeding animals ?
What did she consistently reproduce in her progeny ?
What’s Bint Bukra's horses personality ?
Did you know her presonnally ? If yes, what was your opinion about her ?

Have a nice day !

Amélie

You should be doing this with *Pharrah. I would have something to say there!!! (maybe because I own a double grandson?)

I don't have any *Bint Bukra blood in my herd/on my sales list. Or at least, not yet! I've got an Ansata Imperial grandson though. An Ansata Shah Zam granddaughter. An Ansata Abu Sudan daughter. No *Bint Bukra.

Sorry I can't help you. If you decide to do one on *Rasheek (Alaa El Din), Maalik, Zedann, Makhsous (through son Makhnificent KA), TheEgyptianPrince/Prince Fa Moniet, *Pharrah, Ansata Abu Sudan, Ansata Joy Amira, etc etc etc (no time to fit all bloodlines!), I could probably help you!

Ohh! Do you have to own a *Bint Bukra horse to add your opinions? I have opinions too...

just a thought, Amelie, for the historical side ~ have you compared the notes provided by Nagel, Forbis through their books with the bonus of von Szandter's notes in the latest Forbis book on this mare and many others?

Hi Amelie,

here Ansata Bint Bukra´s photos.





"Ansata Bint Bukra or Husnia"
Date Foaled August 23, 1959
Gray Mare
Breeder EAO, Egypt
Imported to USA in 1965 and Owned by Ansata.

Note: General Von Szandtner, former EAO Stud Manager, considered Bukra, the dam of Ansata Bint Bukra, to be a "Prima Stut" (first class Saqlawi type, with extreme elegance and refinement), *Ansata Bint Bukra is the first Nazeer daughter in the USA to produce 2 champions.

Info and photos by El Marei

Husnia´s son, Ansata El Naseri ( by Ansata Ibn Sudan)


Husnia´s dam, Bukra


Husnia´s daugthers,
Ansata Rosetta (by Ansata Shah Zaman)
Ansata Bint Mirs (by Sameh)

Husnia´s son, Ansata El Sherif (by Ansata Ibn Halima )


Best Regards,

Marianella

Hi all,

Thanks for the relpies.

Marianella thanks for the photos and infos.

The others :

I'm doing an article for the SOFI newsletter and that's why I'm focusing on a SO mare like Ansata Bint Bukra. You don't have to own or bred those lines to have an opinion. I don't own any of these and I've got one. So please share all your thoughts !

Thanks for the book references but I'd like to get opinions of breeders here. I'm not looking for book quotes I'm already doing this by myself.

Anybody want to add something more ???

Hi Amélie,

in the atachment is a photo of Endow Blu, bred in the U.S. by Tom Patterson.
She is by Ansata Halim Shah out of Ansata Diana by Ansata Ibn Sudan.
On her fatherline you find the well known Ansata Rosetta out of Ansata Bint Bukra!!

Kind regards
Christian Kesseböhmer
Al Muntaha Arabians

Foto: © Erwin Escher

Here another picture also taken by Erwin Escher ©...

...and the last one!

Foto: © Erwin Escher

Two other mares which have Ansata Bint Bukra in their pedigrees:

first EL THAY BUSHRA by El Thay Ibn Halim Shah out of El Thay Bakria


Foto: © Erwin Escher

Second one is her daughter BINT MANSOUR by El Thay Mansour out of El Thay Bushra, Ansata Bint Bukra from both sides -
mother and fatherline...

Foto: © Erwin Escher

And last AL MUNTAHA MA´SAMA by Ashhal Al Rayyan out of Bint Mansour by El Thay Mansour....
5 times Ansata Bint Bukra!!!


Foto: © Erwin Escher

Well, it could be that I am wrong but when it comes to "SO" lines
than Ansata Bint Bukra's most influential daughter Ansata Rosetta
and her most influential grandaughter Ansata Delilah are not included on that list -
and certainly not Ansata Halim Shah or Ansata Imperial (and Imperial Imdal etc)
nor any of their get.
What a loss!

I would suggest to ask Judi Forbis for her opinion as she was the
one who owned Ansata Bint Bukra... I doubt there are many people
out there who have seen Ansata Bint Bukra in the flesh.

I am very fortunate to have two mares with Ansata Bint Bukra in the pedigree. Ansata Starletta is actually double Bint Bukra, being by Ansata Halim Shah, and also tracing in tail female to this lovely mare. I also have El Miladi Zaynah, who is by the *Morafic son, Zedann, and she also traces in tail female to Ansata Bint Bukra through her dam, Ansata Nawarra.

I agree that Judi Forbis is the best person, of course, to ask about Bint Bukra, but I wanted to tell Oliver that there are indeed several of us (still alive, amazing) that have personal memories of this great mare. I have many fond memories of her, and even assisted her in foaling one year! Despite her disability, she was always a "queen." One thing that the photos of Bint Bukra do not do justice to were her huge "poppy" eyes. She also had an extreme dish from the side. I have a few candid shots of her in profile in my photo albums.

Starletta (pictured) has a "Bukra" look about her from certain angles -- not surprising from her pedigree, but when I see her strike that pose, it always brings this great old Nazeer daughter to mind.

Best Regards,

Cynthia Culbertson

You are very fortunate to have experienced this great mare in the flesh.
To look at Starletta's photo reminds me a lot of the famous
Sparagowksi shot of Bint Bukra that one graced the cover
of Arabian Horse World. She looks amazingly similiar.

Cynthia, what do you think, could you imagine to write
an article about her for Desert Heritage...
I would love to read this.

Oh, just another "Bint Bukra question":
Did you know her son, Ansata El Sherif?
How was he like?

Dear Cynthia,
thanks for sharing with us this beautiful photo of your Starletta, she has such a beautiful, big eyes - I would really love to see other photos of her, do you have
a profile head shot? This particular one, is now entered in my collection of the
best AH photos. See you in Paris, in December

Paola

Cynthia,

Ansata Starletta is gorgeous. Who do you breed her to and what has she produced for you?

Oliver,

Although I'm not Cynthia, I saw Ansata El Sherif a couple of different times in his life. The first was at the Hardin's (spelling), at El Sherif Arabians in California when he was a younger horse. The second time was when he was an aged horse at Bentwood prior to their dispersal. He was a striking animal, probably the best 'blend' of *Ansata Ibn Halima and *Ansata Bint Bukra of their offspring. More of a Halima body/action with Bukra's head. The best of both worlds.

I'd have to disagree slightly on *Ansata Bint Bukra's most important offspring. I'd probably put *Ansata Bint Misr, her lovely Sameh daughter, in that slot. While not nearly as ethereal as her maternal sister, Ansata Rosetta, *Ansata Bint Misr was a much more consistent producer of both stallions and mares. Virtually every important producing mare at Ansata today traces in direct tail female line to *Ansata Bint Sameh. This mare is the mare line behind Ansata Imperial, Ansata Iemhotep, Ansata Hejazi, Ansata Sokar, Ansata Abu Tai, Ansata Halima Son, Ansata El Mabrouk, Ansata Amon Ra, ad infinitum. And those are just some of the stallions from this branch of the mare line, the daughters Ansata Damietta and Ansata Delilah (particularly Delilah) both founded mare dynasties as well. Just my thoughts.

Jim Robbins
R-Farm

Cynthia:

I enjoyed reading some of your memories of Ansata Bint Bukra and the picture of Ansata Starletta is magnificent. Thanks for sharing it with all of us.

Like Oliver, I am a fan of Ansata El Sherif and eagerly await your memories of him. Marilyn Lang of Fantasia Arabians, Sealy, Texas has a beautiful daughter of his, FA Sherifaa. Can I also ask you about the *Morafic son, Zedann? I grew up in his backyard, never really knowing about him, until it was too late. Do you have pictures to post of El Miladi Zaynah?

Thanks a million,

Ralph

Oliver,

This is Fa Sherifaa, the Ansata El Sherif daughter out of the Babson bred mare, Faserrabba.

Marilyn also owns another Ansata El Sherif daughter, SF Kahla Zahra, out of Sabrah

Ralph, they look gorgeous.

Jim, thanks for sharing your memories
of Ansata El Sherif. You are quite correct
with Ansata Bint Misr. I never saw her but
loved her daughters Ansata Delilah and
Ansata Damietta. Certainly Delilah was one of
Ansata's ultimate producers.
Hmh, by the way these mares deserve a
Portrait at our site

You know what I wonder? For all the people that knew the stallion Ghazal, how does he compare/contrast with Ansata bint Bukra...and would that not have been an awesome cross to try at least once and see what happened? Would the resulting horse have been a true Arabian of southern horse type?

Ralph

Hi Folks !!!

Thanks for sharing all these wonderful photos, memories and other infos ! That's really interesting and helpful...

Olivier,

I already sent an e-mail to Ansata to get some infos.
I'm not writting only about * Ansata Bint Bukra's SO descendants.
First, it would reduce the subject a lot and wouldn't give a true picture of this mare's increadible achievement. In the article I wrote about *Adhem printed on the first SOFI's IAB newsletter, I've talked about *Adhem's two most important SO sons (Saud El Ameer and Khe Adhm) but also about many of his most successful non-SO descendants.
But also, I and all the other SO people like also and are very open to all the different bloodlines. One of the main interest of Sheykh Obeyd horses is their ability to be an outcross for other lines (Polish, Russian, Spanish, etc.) and even within SE lines, as they don't have any line tracing back to the horses presented to King Fouad (called INSHASS horses) who are very well represented within SE lines (especially through El Deree's descendants). As you may already know, they only trace to the horses bred by the first area of Egyptian breeders (Abbas Pasha, Ali Pasha Sherif, the Blunts and others). As for Bint Bukra, this is very much the case. Like others said before, one of her main daughters was Ansata Bint Misr by Sameh, thus being an outcross of a SO mare and a SO+Inshass stallion.
I think other SO breeders would agree on the fact that many horses out of a SO parent and a non-SO horse with a SO parent (ex: SO stallion mated with a daughter of a SO stallion and a non-SO mare) are much of the time of increadible quality ! It's the case for Ansata Bint Misr (Sameh (by El Moez (Sheykh Obeyd) & Sameera (non-SO)) and Ansata Bint Bukra (Sheykh Obeyd)). Of course, there are many horses within other lines who are also of very high quality too. Anyway, linebreeding the highly Abbas Pasha/Ali Pasha Sherif horses that SO horses do represent, while mixing a drop of outcross blood, tend to produce really great horses. I've got many other good examples like *Morafic (SO sire and dam out of a SO mare) and so on.
Anyway, looking at all this stuff and being a superior technician in agriculture specialized in horse production, I was able last year to do a very serious scientific study of the genetic potential of SO horses compared to the global Arabian population (in term of number of show winners within the number of horses shown for every individual). The main difference was found on the 2nd generation (at least one SO grandparent) as many SO breeders already saw when breeding !

I'll do a summary of this of almost 70 pages work in the next SOFI's IAB board newsletter and anybody feel free to ask me for a copy, as well as the first issue already ready. Send me an e-mail to amelieblackwell@hotmail.com .

Have a nice day !

Amélie

Hello Jim Robbins. In your opinion who is the best stallion Today that traces to Ansata Bint Sameh. You say the important mares trace to her. Who would be the stallions?

Here is a photos of Hadba El Tabanna. She is a double Ansata Bint Bukra filly. sired by Masada El Shahwan and out of REA Bint Shesarra.

As for Ansata El Sherif, yes I did see him as well. He was quite a "fairytale" type of white stallion -- very true to his Dahman strain, compact with a lovely head and eye. I also have some photos of him at Bentwood. Thanks to Oliver also for his request about writing about Bint Bukra as well! I will be attending the Ansata seminar (and speaking a bit) in October, which I'm sure will be a delightful occasion as is any spent at Ansata. Perhaps I will discuss with Judi doing a short piece here about my personal memories of a year spent with the Ansata horses. Just to remind folks also about Judith's new book -- there is superb information here and lots of candid shots of the Ansata foundation horses and their descendants. This book is definitely on the "must have" list for straight Egyptian enthusiasts.

Thanks also for the kind comments about Starletta. She is quite the "queen bee" here -- I do believe that horses should be horses, and consequently, mine are outside most of the year here in the lovely New Mexico climate. But when I feed each morning, Starletta loves to "peek" through the barn doors to make sure she is next in line to be fed. I must confess Ansata Manasseh is first in line, then Starletta. She is a small mare (like Bukra) but big in personality, and I have yet to turn her out with any mares that she is not immediately dominant despite her diminuative size!

I agree completely with the comments made about *Ansata Bint Misr -- she is extremely influential -- and was also quite a dominant mare in personality!

Best Regards,

Cynthia Culbertson

Ah, Ralph, forget to address your question! Please e-mail me at elmiladi@tularosa.net (or anyone else who wishes to) and I will gladly tell you about Zedann!

As for the questions concerning Starletta -- in the immediate future she will likely be bred to Ansata Iemhotep and then to Ansata Manasseh for a double Halim Shah cross. Insha'allah, as the Arabs say.

Best Regards,

Cynthia

Thank you so much Ralph for posting a photo of one of my lovely Ansata El Sherif daughters, Fa Sherifaa. She is angelic in appearance and disposition. I am fortunate enough to have two beautiful Fa Sherifaa daughters, one sired by Halim El Mansour and the other sired by AK Sirhalima. Both fillies have the "Bukra" look, those incredible huge black eyes. The lids, both upper and lower, appear to have been outlined in thick, black khol eye liner. Quite awsome and I have not seen that look on to many Arabs in all my years of breeding. My other two Ansata El Sherif daughters, SF Khala Zahra and AK Rabiya have the same "Bukra" look in their lovely heads. I am the luckiest breeder in the world to have three such beautiful Egyptian mares. We recently took photos of the three mares together and I would love to post some photos in the next few days. My dream is to breed one of their daughters back to a stallion with Ansata El Sherif close up in the pedigree. Gosh, I do sound like I am bragging but I do love these mares and only wish I could say I was the breeder of such quality individuals.

Cynthia, your Starletta is so beautiful and so typical of the Bukra blood. You are also a very lucky girl.

Best Regards,
Marilyn

Good Morning, Ralph,
you made my day.......posting photos of this beautiful flea-bitten mare .
A nice day,

Paola

Cynthia,

Starletta is beautiful! Lovely eyes. In the classifieds section, I saw a Manasseh daughter or granddaughter and so I went to the portrait section to look at him. He is also quite stunning. Manasseh and Starletta and Hotep and Starletta - I would love to see either one of these crosses! Prince Fa Moniet with Hotep and *Jamill with Manasseh.

Looking at all these gorgeous, eye-opening Ansata horses makes me "hungry" to have one. I have already decided that we NEED a Halim Shah mare (or filly to be a future broodmare) for our fairly-new breeding program, but to find one with the perfect pedigree and the Halim Shah look (the ANSATA Halim Shah look) for a price that suites our pocketbooks is hard to find. We do have a Prince Fa Moniet granddaughter though, and her 2001 filly by Makhnificent KA.

We own a Zedann granddaughter - you mentioned in an earlier post that you have a Zedann daughter. Her lines are all Egyptian but not by the Pyramid Society, because of a *Turfa line. She is a *Rasheek (Alaa El Din) daughter with a Babson (Saqlawiyah) tail female.

I am still in awe.... Starletta is so GORGEOUS!
Debbie

Wow ! Between the pictures of Hafid Jamil and the Escher pictures in particular posted here...it is nearly enough to make one convert to sE. Simply, wonderfully beautiful mares. They make the heart sing and ache at the same time!

Here another mare with Ansata Bint Bukra on her mothers side:

Shaikh Monhalima by Shaikh Al Badi out of Chafa Monhalima by Ansata El Sherif (A. Ibn Halima x A. Bint Bukra)...

Foto: © Erwin Escher

...and in motion


Foto again: © Erwin Escher

Christian:

You have posted these pictures before on this forum and I never had the opportunity to express my appreciation for your mare. I have heard that her mother, Chafa Monhalima was one of the most beautiful daughters of Ansata El Sherif. I never saw her, only am repeating the words that I have been told. You are a very fortunate man to have this powerful tail female line. Thanks for further "brightening" this thread with your mare's picture. She's awesome.

Ralph

Ralph sent us this beautiful photo of three Ansata El Sherif daughters
along with this lines:


THE THREE SHERIFAS
Marilyn Lang of Fantasia Arabians, Texas, USA sent me the most
awesome photo today of her three Ansata El Sherif daughters.
This lovely photo was recently taken in Spring, 2003.

The identity of the mares, as pictured, is established from left to right:

The first mare:
AK Rabiya - Ansata El Sherif x Glorietta Tala - 1983

The second mare:
Fa Sherifaa - Ansata El Sherif x Faserrabba - 1985

The third mare
SF Khala Zahra - Ansata El Sherif x Sabrah - 1984


Are they not completely wonderful???
Hope this picture brings you as much joy, as they brought me.

Ralph

ANSATA ALMURTAJIZ out of bint bukra

ANSATA SULEYMA the full sister to ALMURTAJIZ out of bint bukra

SALMAN EZZAIN out of ansata suleyma,a promissing future stallion at EZZAIN ARABIANS

How beautiful these horses are! But one tiny correction. I think Ansata Almurtajiz is out of Ansata Samsara, who in turn is out of the famous Ansata Samantha who traces back to Ansata Bint Bukra in tail female line (as well as Ansata Hejzai, his sire).

my dear Babs,you are absolutely correct,here is one more pic.of ALMURTAJIZ

Re: Ansata Bint Bukra

After looking at the picture of Ansata Starletta I just had to put in my five cents worth. I have Ansata El Ibriz, who is similarly bred (a Halim Shah son and out of Ansata Rebecca) with dam lines of sire and dam tracing to Ansata Bint Bukra. The heads of both of them look to be very much alike.

Since I have not had the good fortune to see Bint Bukra, I really enjoyed looking at the pictures.

I am going to try to attach a picture of El Ibriz. Hopefully it will work.

Regards
Nancy Bourque/Ibriz Arabians

He is definetely "in the club" and looks like a valuable member of the Bint Bukra family. I saw his full brother Ansata Ramazan (spelling?) as a young horse and though later gelded he too looked very classy. An Ansata Rebecca son is in Germany, by Prince Fa Moniet. His name is Ansata Ramesses and he, too is a fine specimen. Another pair are Bint Rebecca and Radames II (Salaa El Dine x Ansata Rebecca), both very typey individuals but more stamped by Salaa El Dine in type.



Radames II, photo by Dirnhofer

Dear Guntram,
Radamess 2 is great horse,i know his full sister bint rebecca at alnakeeb,wow she looks special,can i know who own RadamessII
POSSIBLY HASANAIN believes she looks like this

Usamah!!!

Now, I am confused! Because you are a lover of the Dahmahs...three circles, two circles...circles circles circles...curvy short-coupled balanced (in some places more than others) ...I would think you would like this more!

Hey guys - let's stay with horses! My beloved wife is already jealous enough because of the time I'am spending with SE.com. But if she is going to see this, I'll be plugged off ...

Dr. Wigger, I think it's better to buy your wife a pair of sun glasses...
Here we go Usamah:
THIS is the way Bint Rebecca looks like

She has that certain extra-something in her eyes... I talk of Bint Rebecca, of course!!!

by the way Radames II is owned by Achim Dirnhofer. His
website for you.

dear guntram,
woooooow you must be the best horseman on earth and bint rebecca is the ultimum mare there is or was thank you for the information
dear dr.wigger,an appetizer is always helpful with .....you know what???

Dear Mr. Alkazemi,



By the way thanks a lot for the beautiful pictures of Hebbattollah! She was a real appetizer for me to chose Ibn Nejdy for my mare.

OK,lets see who is more photogenic Sofia or Bint Rebecca.

Hmmmmh, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. The equine equivalent of Sophia is for sure Bint Rebecca. Both are beautiful ladies.